Chatlog 8-17-06 cathy says to (18:59): Other than the notice that the beneficiary has in hand, is there anything (e.g. BPQY) that would alert the Benefits Specialist of the section 301 status? admin says (18:59): Great question - I am not sure!!! I don't think the BPQY includes section 301 status. I think you would have to ask the CR a direct question on this. mkoch says to (19:00): Same question here with regard to the paid employment having to be above SGA in order to terminate 301 status? admin says (19:00): No. paid employment does NOT need to be at the SGA level for it to cause loss of section 301 status - that is what is a bit scary BarbaraB says to angie (19:01): Would this include a YTD Project with a vocational plan and person centered plan even if no other VR agency or other agency is involved, throughout the length of the study? admin says (19:02): Possibly. As long as there was an individualized plan for employment I think you could make a strong case for getting it approved. becca in md says to (19:04): I had a question about interruptions for someone in approved 301 status: if the interruption lasts longer than 3 months is the person responsible for paying back the 3 months of benefits they might have received? admin says (19:04): I am not 100% sure as this is not specifically addressed in the regulations. However, my guess would be that you would get the payments for the three months, than anything after than you would have to pay back. kim says to (19:05): Would anyone like to share outreach ideas for reaching high school students? admin says (19:05): Please post this question on the webboard so that folks can comment on it jessica says to (19:06): It's nice to know that there is something out there for individuals to use while they prepare for employment - especially if determined medically improved in the middle of their goal. Can you please tell me what the ODO stands for again? I missed it. admin says (19:06): ODO stands for the Office of Disability Operations I believe. orange0110 says to (19:06): is there a limit to the number of 3 month 'breaks' one could have and if it's more than one is there an amount of time they have to be 'active' between breaks? admin says (19:06): No, the regulations currently do not limit the number of temporary interruptions that a person can have. Pat says to (19:07): Would it be acceptable by Social Security to encourage 17 year olds on SSI to pursue an IEP through the school system? admin says (19:08): I don't see why not. I doubt busy CRs would think to offer this advice, but the BPAO/WIPA projects certainly can do this mkoch says to (19:09): Once a plan has been approved, is there much of a likelihood that adjustments can be made to it? Would we then just contact the CR if it's possible to make the adjustments? admin says (19:09): Well, I think IEPs and such do get changed - sometimes quite often. I think as long as you are communicating with SSA and as long as the new plan continues to meet the likelihood test, the beneficiary should be OK. djuna says to (19:10): Hi Lucy, I have a former beneficiary with an SSI overpayment. I think that 301 might have applied for part of the time period involved in the overpayment, can he use 301 to have the overpayment reduced? admin says (19:10): Well, perhaps - it would depend on how long ago all this happened and whether the person was actually eligible for section 301 but everybody missed it. The rules on administrative finality may not allow you to go backwards and claim section 301 paula says to (19:12): Should we be advising folks to sign on with an agency rather than get jobs on their own, so they would have a "plan" admin says (19:12): Well, I think you need to discuss the options people have - section 301 would not make sense to someone with a severe lifelong disability because the possibility of improving medically does not exist. angie says to (19:13): Would a student who was receiving SSI and graduated with a special diploma and is 19 be assumed into 301 status until age 21 and their SSI continue even after redetermination? admin says (19:13): Well, yes - assuming the section 301 status was caught right after the medical determination. The payment could continue till the age of 21. There would be a regular review with SSA MSBPAO says to (19:14): Does SSA or VCU have any one or two page flyers that provide consumers with details about Section 301? admin says (19:14): No - I wish we did!!! All we have is the briefing paper we developed for the YTD programs and that is a bit long and technical. Thanks for the great idea - iw ill get to work on this! Pat says to (19:15): Are the 301 payments shown as income for Food Stamps eligibility? admin says (19:15): They would count in the same way as a regular SSI/SSDI payment would - no difference! orange0110 says to (19:16): so if they become active then get sick again 6 months from the first interruption they lose 301 status? admin says (19:16): No, I think they would just get another temporary interruption. I see nothing in the current regs that limits the number of temporary interruptions a person can have. becca in md says to (19:17): I am confused about statement about CDRs not happening while a Ticket is assigned. I know the work ones don't, but one of my consumers had a scheduled CDR occur and he still had to do that one. Should he not have had to? admin says (19:17): Medical CDRs are not supposed to be conducted for people who have their ticket in assignment and in current use. Now, sometimes no one tells SSA that the ticket is assigned and in use, so the CDR accidentally gets done. that can be corrected. jessica says to (19:18): Would it be beneficial to the individual to explain how Section 301 could benefit them especially if we see that they may need to use it in the future? admin says (19:18): Yes - I would explain this to people for whom medical recovery is a possibility. Some diseases go into remission, etc. paula says to (19:19): What if part-time employment occurs before cessation? Is that a problem? admin says (19:19): No, it should not be. The section 301 eligibility would be processed in the usual way. kim says to (19:20): Can a student' IEP be updated to include a paying work study program after the student has started receiving 301 payments? admin says (19:20): Yes, I assume so. I have seen this happen quite a bit and I cannot imagine that it would adversely impact section 301 status. Just make sure SSA is aware of the new goal orange0110 says to (19:21): so if a medical CDR was on the diary before ticket assignment and they are medically recovered, they'd be eligible for 301, but their EN may drop them due to the ticket lose? admin says (19:21): Hey, you're on top of this! Yup - that is the problem. If you go into section 301 status, you cannot assign a ticket djuna says to (19:22): where would I find the rules on administrative finality? admin says (19:22): In the POMS. We have a link to the POMS online from our website. Just go into the POMS and search under that specific phrase and you will find all sorts of citations bgray says to (19:23): It seems to me that BPAO/WIPA role would legitimately include getting special ed personnel to understand that if they will write a "real" individualized plan that this provision takes the fear out of the age 18 redet. Also, PASS is now "approved plan". admin says (19:23): Yes, I think this is legitimate. It is all good when kids complete their educational program - that is what these changes mean - SSA really understands this. Mary Anne says to (19:24): Does SSA automatically put the person in 301 or does the disabled person have to request it? admin says (19:24): Ruh-roh. Technically, he may not have been eligible for the payments he received. the local FO should be able to contact the person at ODO who processed the section 301 case to get instructions - that is what I would suggest. orange0110 says to (19:25): i know VR would continue their plan, but does an EN have too? admin says (19:25): Nope - ticket is entirely voluntary from the EN's perspective. They can stop serving someone for any reason they choose. Mary Anne says to (19:26): So if a person between 18-21 doing a part-time job while going to school and SSA determine the person disability has improved and there no IEP, Can the BPAO try to show SSA that there was intent to do an IEP, but the high school counselor has not had time admin says (19:26): Nope - the regs don't care about intent - there has to actually be a signed plan and the person has to have been participating in the program when medical improvement started - or when the person turned 18 jeff says to (19:27): This didn't let me type the end of my question.....The client has been receiving Medicare and payments for over a year since he started work and the local office who said they have no clue does not know if he'll have to pay it all back or not. admin says (19:27): Oh dear - I would suggest that the claims rep call ODO ASAP!!! ODO is where these decisions are made, not at the local level. orange0110 says to (19:28): i was asking if on the rare occasion where a medical CDR is on the diary before ticket assignment and they are determined medically recovered. if now under 301 does an EN , NOT VR, have to continue services? admin says (19:28): No - they don't jessica says to (19:30): Can you please explain Section 301 and redetermination at 18? I wrote down briefly that it can apply but that you don't have to pay anything back if determination is changed. Is this correct? admin says (19:30): I can't type enough here to explain this very well - this is explained in the briefing paper I wrote on this subject on our YTD website. You can get this at www.vcu-ytd.org and then look for resources. It should be posted there. Mary Anne says to (19:31): Does SSA automatically put the person in 301 or does the disabled person have to request it? admin says (19:31): Unfortunately, it is NOT automatic - the person must request it and then it can take awhile to get a determination because must SSA personnel are not familiar with this obscure provision jeff says to admin (19:33): When a CDR is done and improvement is determined but the person was receiving VR services, what is the process for requisition 301? admin says (19:33): Good question - the person needs to write to SSA and state that they believe they are eligible for continued payments under section 301. It is helpful if a copy of the IPE is included. Be sure to keep a copy of this correspondence for the record. Mary Anne says to (19:35): Will the person be entitled to back 301 payments if SSA determines he meets 301 payments but it took several months for them to make a decision? admin says (19:35): Yes, getting past due payments would not be a problem. Another thing you could do would be file an appeal of the determination within 10 days to keep the check, then request section 301 in the meantime. jeff says to admin (19:39): A student on SSI using the SEIE with an IEP happens to be working part time in the summers would not be able to use "301" because there is paid employment (unless that employment was part of the plan)? admin says (19:39): That is my take on things, but it would be interesting to see what ODO would do on that one. These changes are so new, the situations like this have not been tested. Mary Anne says to (19:40): Your receiving 301 payments your condition gets worse do you get back on title ll benefits and still be eligible for work incentives admin says (19:40): Yes, when you get regular SSI/SSDI payments you can use work incentives again. admin says (19:42): Thanks for all the great questions - you all kept my little fingers BUSY. if you have any more questions, just post them to the web board.